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Topic: Coming to America eventually  (Read 674 times)
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« on: August 25, 2010, 09:18:12 PM »
Vince the Fox Offline
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Aug. 25, 2010 12:52 PM
Associated Press
MEXICO CITY - A Mexican drug cartel massacred 72 Central and South American migrants within 100 miles of the U.S. border that they were trying to reach, according to an Ecuadorian survivor who escaped and stumbled wounded to a highway checkpoint where he alerted marines, official said Wednesday.

The marines fought the cartel gunmen at a ranch in the northern state of Tamaulipas on Tuesday, a battle that left one marine and three suspects dead. They found the bodies of 58 men and 14 women in a room, some piled on top of each other.


The Ecuadorian migrant told investigators that his captors identified themselves as members of the Zetas drug gang, said Vice Adm. Jose Luis Vergara, a spokesman for the Mexican Navy. Authorities believe the migrants were from Honduras, El Salvador, Brazil and Ecuador.

It is the biggest massacre to date in Mexico's drug war and the most horrifying example yet of the dangers faced by immigrants trying to get to the U.S.

"It's absolutely terrible and it demands the condemnation of all of our society," said Alejandro Poire, the government's security spokesman.

Authorities did not say why the gang killed the migrants. Mexico's drug cartels frequently kidnap migrants and threaten to kill them unless they pay fees for crossing their territory. Sometimes, gangs contact relatives of the migrants in the U.S. and demand they pay a ransom.

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« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2010, 10:28:25 PM »
theshadow Offline
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Vince:

 It is a real danger.  But it is free enterprise.  We buy their drugs and we sell them our weapons.  Just to give you an idea of the desire of those migrants for a better life, the Ecuadorean that survived the massacre paid $ 11K (yes, 11 thousand) to the coyote (the facilitator) in his home town in the southern province of Cañar in Ecuador.

The Shadow
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« Reply #2 on: August 27, 2010, 03:52:40 AM »
Vince the Fox Offline
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Sorry Mr. Shadow... but I have a hard time linking..Murder/Slaughter of human beings to "free enterprize".....We have always had drugs etc,etc..

I guess when liberal mayors/governors/journalists  have their lives threatend or have family murdered... they will understand... then it will be too late I.M.O.

We already have death threats against Sheriff Joe Arpaio and Sheriff Paul Babeu.. these sheriffs enforce the 2 largest counties in AZ... Yet the "SICK PUKES" in the Obama administration are fighting against US [AZ] enforcing the law....We have to wait until these "MAGGOTTS" kill someone... or do major crimes... its just pathetic...
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« Reply #3 on: August 27, 2010, 07:33:40 AM »
theshadow Offline
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I guess the "free enterprise" sarcasm/satire flew over your head but the facts must be faced and the responsibility acknowledged.

 Drug use and weapons sales are realities that fuel and enable the violence.

Death threats and even assassinations and attempts against politicians/officials/public figures of all persuasions are not new  (the Kennedy brothers, Regan MLK).  Perpetration of killings (mass murders at restaurants or work places)  and major crimes by citizens/legal residents are all around us,  so focusing on illegals begs the question. 

The Shadow
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« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2010, 03:59:20 AM »
Vince the Fox Offline
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How can you even compare crime in Mexico to Crime in the United states?
I,m talking about recent crime... Not the Kennedy assasinations... Are you serious?
 The drug and human smugglers are ruthless killers.. Terrorists in my opinion...Obama and liberals in his Admin. need to realize the threat..It Narco- terrorism must be attacked at all levels...Many illegals[ when caught] have lead police to the cartels drophouses, hideouts  and weapons/drugs/ millions in cash have been siezed....the border will never be secured without "interior enforcment" SB 1070]

Mexican official probing massacre is missing
Aug. 27, 2010 04:50 PM
Associated Press
SAN FERNANDO, Mexico - Two cars exploded early Friday in a northern state where officials are investigating the killing of 72 Central and South American migrants, and a prosecutor investigating the massacre has disappeared.

The prosecutor, Roberto Jaime Suarez, vanished Wednesday in the town of San Fernando, where the bodies of the migrants were found, the Tamaulipas state attorney general's office said in a statement. A transit police officer in the town was also missing.


President Felipe Calderon, speaking during a forum on security, said Suarez, a Tamaulipas state prosecutor, was involved in the initial investigation into the massacre, which authorities have blamed on the Zetas drug gang. The federal attorney general's office has since taken the lead in the case.

The two car explosions occurred less than 45 minutes apart in Ciudad Victoria, the Tamaulipas state capital, the attorney general's office said. The first exploded in front of the offices of the Televisa network and the second in front of transit police offices.

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« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2010, 12:13:37 PM »
theshadow Offline
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Vince:

 You are correct in all your appraisals.  It is a problem.  The cartels are more ruthless and powerful than anything this country has seen.  More ruthless than the Mafia in the times of prohibition. There were turf wars then, corruption of police and public officials etc.  Then as today, a particular ethnic group was predominant in that activity.  The Mafia and similar groups are still around and still involved in the activities that eventually will clash with those of the cartels.  Then it is possible that the turf wars will become even more violent and inside the US.

However, I will maintain that just as in the the times of prohibition and the Mafia wars we are dealing with a demand/supply problem.  A demand for drugs/cheap labor etc. on our side of the border and for guns on the other side.
What to do about it?   I don't know.   

Blocking immigration will only increase the profit potential.  If you consider that the Ecuadorean who escaped the massacre paid $ 11 thousand to the "facilitator" to be smuggled into the US then if immigration is stopped the price/profit will go up.  The cartels take no risk.   Certainly as the stories of the massacres travel in Central/South America fewer people may try to come.   The problem is not one that has an easy solution.

Some history for perspective  http://www.fbi.gov/hq/cid/orgcrime/lcnindex.htm

The Shadow

 
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« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2010, 09:03:56 AM »
theshadow Offline
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Vince:

It is here in Ohio and who knows how many other states.

http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2010/08/29/village-on-drug-war-front.html?sid=101

Be it drugs or cheap willing labor where there is demand there will be suppliers.


The Shadow is not optimistic


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« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2010, 03:12:25 AM »
Vince the Fox Offline
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Mr. Shadow... I agree... I am not optimistic either...The "Greatest Generation" would never have allowed this....We are a nation of "liberal Wussies"  We have a bunch of P.C. Whiney sniveling little Bitches running this nation... I hope we can change it....P.S.  its time for an experiment... Let California legalize/tax the Weed... Lets see what happens... everyone is getting high over there anyway.....I would like to see an experiment...What are we afraid of?
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« Reply #8 on: August 30, 2010, 09:19:31 PM »
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Two Mayor's Assassinated in Two Weeks

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This has turned into a extremely high risk position. This is the 2nd mayor in this area in 2 weeks to be assassinated. Totally out of control!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100830/...rug_war_mexico

NUEVO LAREDO, Mexico – Gunmen killed the mayor of a town in the drug-plagued Mexican border state of on Sunday in a region where suspected cartel hitmen recently massacred 72 migrants, the government said.

Hidalgo Mayor Marco Antonio Leal Garcia was the second mayor to be assassinated in the past two weeks in the area, which has become a battleground between the Gulf and Zetas cartels.

President Calderon condemned the attack on Leal Garcia, which left the mayor's daughter wounded.

"This cowardly crime, and the reprehensible violent acts that occurred recently in this state, strengthen the commitment of the Mexican government to continue fighting the criminal gangs that seek to intimidate the families of Tamaulipas," Calderon's office said in a statement.

Leal Garcia's rural town, Hidalgo, has about 25,000 inhabitants. It lies southwest of a part of Tamaulipas where a massacre survivor said Zetas gunmen killed 72 Central and South American migrants last week.

Hidalgo is also near the border with Nuevo Leon, where the mayor of another town, Santiago, was found murdered on Aug. 18. Local police allied with a drug gang are suspected in that killing.

There were no immediate details on a possible motive in Leal Garcia's slaying, but Calderon's reference to "criminal gangs" and the nature of the slaying suggest drug cartel involvement. Local media reported Leal Garcia was killed as he left his ranch.

Tamaulipas state security officials did not answer phone calls seeking comment.

Some cartels have been known to carry out targeted shootings that kill the intended victim, but not children riding in the same vehicle. Leal Garcia's daughter was reportedly shot in the leg.

Tamaulipas has seen at least two other killings of political figures this year. Rodolfo Torre, the front-running candidate for the state's governorship, was gunned down on a highway June 28, and in May, gunmen killed a candidate for mayor of the town of Valle Hermoso.

Calderon's administration promised to increase security in the area after a series of explosive devices were detonated in the Tamaulipas capital: Reynosa, across the border from McAllen, Texas.

The Interior Department said it "energetically condemned" the explosions in Reynosa, but did not confirm local media reports that the explosions were caused by three hand grenades and that they had wounded roughly a dozen people. The department confirmed there were some victims, and offered to help them.

The Reynosa city government said on its Twitter site that "an explosive device" detonated downtown near the La Quebradita bar on Saturday, and advised residents to stay out of the area. Cross-border traffic was not affected.

The slaughter of the migrants was discovered last Tuesday in San Fernando, a town near Reynosa.

The Central and South Americans were apparently killed after they refused to work for the gang. Drug gangs have branched out into human trafficking for extortion and to recruit members.

Thirty-five had been identified by Sunday: 16 Hondurans, 13 Salvadorans, five Guatemalans and a Brazilian. Documents belonging to another Brazilian man were found at the scene of the killings, but his body has not been identified. The lone survivor, an Ecuadorean, escaped and reported the slaughter to the Mexican military.

Diplomats from the victims' home countries have traveled to Tamaulipas to get firsthand reports on the identification efforts. Most of those identified so far carried documents. But bodies found without documents present a much bigger challenge.


Guatemala offered to send a plane to pick up five victims identified so far from that country. Families of three said they received telephone calls earlier in the month demanding $2,000 for their relatives' release. Guatemala's foreign ministry said it was still trying to contact families of the other two dead.

Migrants hopping freight trains through Mexico to get to the United States are often subjected to kidnappings, beatings and extortion along the way.

A group of them protested Saturday in the railroad town of Arriaga in southern Chiapas state, where many migrants cross the border from Guatemala.

The Rev. Hayman Vazquez, a Roman Catholic priest who runs the Casa del Migrante shelter in Arriaga, said about 120 people marched along the railroad tracks to the city hall with banners reading "Please respect us," and "The kidnapping of migrants in Mexico is a humanitarian tragedy."

Vazquez said undocumented migrants continued to arrive at the shelter this week. Even when told of the massacre, most said they would still try to reach the U.S. because there are no opportunities in their home countries, he said.

Salvadoran President Mauricio Funes said Saturday he wants to meet with Mexico's Calderon to coordinate efforts to combat drug violence. More than 28,000 Mexicans have been killed in drug-related violence since Calderon launched an offensive against the cartels in late 2006. "This war is not going to be won using the tools and methods traditionally used to fight crime," Funes said. "The challenge posed by the criminals requires other responses, other weapons, and intelligence."
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